Milford Shirley is the President of the Jacksonville Chapter of the Experimental Aircraft Association, a group that gained major attention over a zoning dispute with the city last year. Shirley also hosts his own radio talk show. He was kind enough to answer a few questions for JaxDaily.
JaxDaily: First off, what is the Experimental Aircraft Association?
Milford Shirley: The EAA is a group of people that have the hobby of building aircraft as a common thread. Paul Poberezney was a WW2 pilot and along with a handful of others in Wisconsin formed the Association. It has grown to a world wide organization that does a lot more than just work with the FAA on protecting our right to build and fly. We also have what we call the Young EAgles program where we take kids between the ages of 8 and 17 up for a ride in a general aviation aircraft. The kids are absolutely thrilled and the pilots have a great time showing off the hobby they love!
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JaxDaily: How did you first become interested in aviation yourself? When did you join the EAA?
Milford Shirley: I’m a late bloomer. When I was growing up I never thought about becoming a pilot even though I was always interested in airplanes. The idea of becoming a pilot for my private enjoyment would have been a foreign idea. Then my very young next door neighbor announced he was working on his Private Pilot Certificate. By nature I’m not a jealous person, but this was an exception. After listening to me gripe for 2 weeks about it, my wife finally told me that if I would go get mine she would pay for it!
I actually joined the local chapter of EAA while I was going through my training just as an additional way to learn about flying. The idea of building an aircraft in my garage was pretty far out there at the time. After going to a few meetings and looking through the magazines I started realizing that there were a lot of highly skilled craftsmen that took this thing very seriously.
On the FAA aircraft register, about 20% of all general aviation aircraft are actually what are termed Experimental meaning they were built by a private individual.
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JaxDaily: A few months back, your group was involved in a dispute with the City of Jacksonville, can you go into a bit more detail on that? How did it all turn out?
Milford Shirley: I could write a book about that ordeal. One of our mebers, Brian Kraut, walked into one of our monthly meetings and told us about the new law in Jacksonville that made it illegal to touch an aircraft in the privacy of your own garage. It sounds like I’m making this up but if you had a fully enclosed garage with the windows shut you could not legally change the oil, wire the radio, or upholster the seat. Brian had been fighting this thing for over a year without telling us. He is by nature a quiet, private guy, so we did not know anything about the problems he had been going through. He had a neighbor that didn’t like anything he did. She had complained about everything from where his garbage cans were to him having his outdoor lights on after 9pm.
When we decided to help with this fight I wanted to make sure that Brian wasn’t actually a trouble maker so I canvassed his neighborhood to see if he had caused problems. Every one of his neighbors were solidly behind him being able to work on his aircraft. One lady told me that she liked it when he was working on them because that way she knew where her son was! Politically it was a very dirty trick pulled on Brian. He had been fighting zoning all this time and winning when he tried to talk to his city council member to ask for relief. The C/M refused to talk to him saying that he would not get into the middle of an argument between 2 neighbors. That is reasonable and Brian accepted it, but later this C/M talked to the neighbor lady and then WITHOUT going back to get Brian’s side created a special law aimed at Brian, and collaterally the rest of the Jacksonville home builders. In the end after a lot of hard work by a lot of people to educate the council on aircraft home building we had Glorious Johnson step up to sponsor a repeal of this very overbearing law. I can’t say enough about Glorious Johnson, she is a different kind of politician. Even without the help she gave us I would still be a big fan.
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JaxDaily: Do you have an opinion about the extension of runways at Craig Airfield?
Milford Shirley: I believe like most arguments the truth lies somewhere in the middle. While longer runways are inherently safer the JAA is going a little overboard in portraying the imminent danger. The neighborhoods are likewise acting a little holier than thou about the “promises” that were made. Technology marches forward and what was fine in 1942 when the airport was laid out will not be OK forever. Plus, if you move near an airport you should expect airplane noise. In the end I’m glad it is not up to me to decide what to do, I’m not sure which way I would fall.
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JaxDaily: What are some of the projects you’ve worked on building?
Milford Shirley: I’ve got a project called a Midget Mustang. It is a small, single seat, 100 HP aircraft that should be a lot of fun if I manage to finish it. I am also in a partnership with 2 other EAA members on a 2 seat open cockpit biplane, Starduster Too. I’m pretty excited about that project too. These are the kinds of aircraft that you cannot buy, you can only build.
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JaxDaily: Tell us a little bit about your radio program, when did you begin hosting that?
Milford Shirley: We actually have the zoning fight to thank for that. Glenn Boyles of Glenn in the Afternoon, a local political radio show interviewed me as the local EAA president. He ended up giving us a lot of coverage and after it was all over approached me and Brian about doing a general aviation show. We laughed about it for a while but it was a tempting idea. We decided to try it out and the first Saturday in 2008 we went live. By the way, I’ve relistened to the first couple of shows we did and I’m not sure why we came back! I think we’ve gotten better at it and I know we have a lot of fun doing it. If anyone would like to see a little about us and listen to the show, our web site is www.flighttimeradio.com
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JaxDaily: If someone is interested in joining the EAA, what should they do?
Milford Shirley: The national web site is www.eaa.org and our local site is www.eaajax.com. There is contact info there and we would love to have anyone come out that is even thinking about flying. You will be welcome to come to a few meetings to see if you really want to join.
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JaxDaily: Thanks very much for talking with us, do you have anything else you’d like to add?
Milford Shirley: I appreciate the opportunity to talk about the sport/hobby of flying. I would encourage anyone that has thought it might be fun to find a way to try it out.
One simple way is to take a glider flight at Herlong. Gliders are much cheaper and you can get your glider license relatively quick. It would then be an easier transition to step up to a powered certificate.
July 15th, 2008 at 3:37 pm
I don’t think people should be allowed to build dangerous experimental airplanes in their garages and keep people up all night long. Neighbors have rights too.
July 15th, 2008 at 9:45 pm
What makes you think an experimental aircraft is dangerous? Did you know that the accident statistics between certificated aircraft, (factory built) and experimental are virtually identical.
As far as keeping you up all night by the noise from my garage, do you think I want to be up all night long? Don’t you think my family wants to sleep also? If I was doing wood work as a hobby would that be OK?
I’m not sure why only aircraft building seems to bother you but I will say thank goodness we live in a country that allows me and you both to pursue whatever brings us happiness as long as it doesn’t infringe on each other.
July 15th, 2008 at 10:42 pm
Let’s try and be rational here. If a person should not be allowed to work on a small personal aircraft in their own garage, should they be allowed to work on their “dangerous” automobile, boat, motorcycle, woodworking project such as replacing the wood trim on their own home? All of these can be noisy at times.
I personally have been involved in working on an airplane and the only “danger” involved was people listening to my stupid jokes! OK, not ALL of them were stupid… ok, maybe they were, but I digress.
I have heard much more noise from my neighbors cutting their grass than I have ever made in my garage. What about that teenager down the street with his ridiculously loud bass speakers that rattle the whole street when he comes home at night? LATE at night!
I do believe that as a neighbor, one should always be courteous of those around them. I would not appreciate my nextdoor neighbor working on an airplane or car or whatever at the wee hours of the morning if I were trying to sleep either. I think we should ALL be good responsible neighbors and quit trying to single out one particular hobby and labeling that negatively.
Can’t we all just get along??? This COULD be a first step towards world peace!
Think about it…
July 15th, 2008 at 11:37 pm
Unfortunatly many people not directly associated with aviation consider what they don’t understand as “dangerous”! The truth is, it’s no more dangerous building an experimental aircraft in a garage then starting a car and pulling it out of the garage. (and probably not as noisy). Most hobbies have a much worse safety record then experimental aircraft.
If you don’t understand, try attending an EAA meeting and you will quickly rethink the dangers involved in building an experimental aircraft. Lighten up J’ville.
A Fellow Aviator
July 15th, 2008 at 11:54 pm
To Fly Safe,
Being a long time active member of the EAA, an experimental aircraft builder, and a pilot since the early seventies… I have NEVER ever heard any news reports anywhere in the nation… of an experimental aircraft being built in the privacy of residential home garage as being considered dangerous, or causing any undue risk to neighbors.
I’m sure all your fellow neighbors who restore and build hot rods, work on their boats and motorcycles, make furniture, and do all sorts of other crafts and hobbies in the privacy of their own garage would like to respond to your comments as well… especially, if you made a comment about their hobby being dangerous and should be banned (as our hobby once was in Jax)… I hope some do… so you will finally realize how silly your comment is about building small aircraft in a homeowners garage is supposedly so dangerous. You may want to educate yourself alittle about a hobby next time before you critisize a hobby you apparently know nothing about.
Your welcome to attend our next EAA meeting at Herlong Airfield the 2nd thursday of each month. Hope to see you there.
July 16th, 2008 at 9:59 am
I do not live in Jacksonville, but followed the development of the law against the construction of aircraft at home with great interest. The city attorney’s office and council members at that time (The council sponsor of the law is gone now) specifically targeted one individual with the law, never giving consideration to the total impact their actions would make.
After passing the law, it placed Jacksonville in a very elite group. The ONLY places in the world where it was against the law to build an aircraft was North Korea, Cuba, Viet Nam, China and Jacksonville.
In my eyes, it makes the officials of the City of Jacksonville look like they gaageeated the 6th grade from Hootersville Central.
July 16th, 2008 at 10:39 am
I have heard people say how frightening it would be to fly in a homebuilt aircraft. I as you to consider the following;
1. Do you think that that airliner you feel so comfortable in was built by someone with magic powers and the intelligence of Dr. Einstein?
I promise you, they are not. In reality, that airliner was built by someone hired off the street ( who may or MAYNOT love flying) and trained on the job. Are you flying in one that he was learning on?
2. Lets say that Johnny Airlinebuilder successfully completed his On-The-Job training. He may not have been the sharpest tool in the tool box, but he finally made it. Two weeks later, he was working along, and just happened to mess-up the part he was working on. It happens to everyone once in awhile. He has a choice, tell the boss that he wasted another hour and a half making a piece of junk and that he used a couple of thousand dollars worth of material doing it, OR he can sorta make it fit, and not tell anyone. Its simple, tell the boss and get hollered at and maybe loose his job, or just keep on trucking as if nothing ever happened. After all, what are the chances he will ever fly in that thing anyway.
What do you think?
The homebuilder on the other hand has a love of aviation and how it works. He may have never had experience building an airplane before, but he for sure has an interest in what he is doing, especially since he is paying out of his pocket. He too is trained on the job, but with the Experimental Aircraft Association, there are hundreds of people right here in Northeast Florida that help each builder, and inspect his work. This is exactly why the Federal Aviation Administration allows this to go on. It is educational, and the education is actually passed on from generation to generation.
Another incentive ….. The guy that builds the airplane is the one that is going to fly the airplane. I assure you, that he CARES if everything is right, where Johnny Airlinebuilder is only interested in quitting time, a beer and a paycheck. Actually, by the time the homebuilt is finished, there have been three aircraft built. The builder threw away the others two in parts because they were not “Just right”, and he wasn’t going to put them on his airplane unless they were.
Burt Rutan, the builder of “Space Ship One” was a builder of experimental aircraft. In the case of Space Ship One, he was the builder of an experimental SPACE craft, but it had to meet the same requirements as those aircraft built right there in Jacksonville. Burt also built “Voyager”, another homebuilt. It flew around the world NON-STOP and NON-REFUELED a few years back. Voyager and Space Ship One and other famous “homebuilts” are now hanging in the Smithsonian Air and Space Museum.
A Rolls-Royce is handcrafted, a homebuilt aircraft is hand crafted, a Chevy Vega was built by a factory worker. Maybe after the Chevy Vega was cancelled, this guy with assembly line experience is now building airliners!